L ,Ha rgb

Questions and answers about processing in StarTools and how to accomplish certain tasks.
Burly
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L ,Ha rgb

Post by Burly »

Hi ivo ignore my ignorance if this has been asked a million time i have got hold of a data set off SGL m51 L,HA RGB currently doing lRGB in compose what is the best way workflow to combine all data so i can inc Ha .
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Re: L ,Ha rgb

Post by admin »

No problem! It's a question that gets asked a lot and it depends a little on how much Ha you acquired and how you want to incorporate the Ha.
You can add the Ha to L if it is particularly deep, or just add it to R if you just want a colour boost.
To add it to R, you can either use the Compose module to create a new composite of R+Ha, save that and re-open it as your "new" R. Or you can use the Layer module for the same purpose.
Any trouble, do let me know!
Ivo Jager
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almcl
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Re: L ,Ha rgb

Post by almcl »

Hope Burly will forgive me for hi-jacking his thread, but I recently had the same situation, wanting to add Ha to the Red channel of some RGB data and couldn't quite work out what steps to use in the compose module?

I had the Red, separated from the RGB and saved as a .tiff file, together with a separate Ha stack but couldn't work out how to combine these in the Compose module. (Eventually used the layer module but not sure I got the settings right.)

A quick 'steps & settings' would be great, if you wouldn't mind?
Skywatcher 190MN, ASI 2600 or astro modded Canon 700d, guided by OAG, ASI120, PHD2
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Re: L ,Ha rgb

Post by admin »

No problem!

This is from a recent thread on the same subject;
Note that this is discussing OSC/DSLR data (e.g. with different channels in one file). If you already have separate stacks for each band, you can skip the first step below;
There are a couple of ways of doing that.

The most flexible, fool-proof way is to create a new red channel (for the purpose of coloring only, but not luminance!). You can use the Compose module to extract the red channel from your full-color datasets. Just load your color stack into the red channel only and it will extract just the red channel and create a "black and white" dataset out of just that channel (if Channel Interpolation is On). You can then save that dataset and extract the next one.
If you already have separate stacks for each band, you can skip the above. Following on;
Once you got these two mono datasets (one with red channel, one with Ha), you can use the Layer module to create a blend, or you can use the Compose module (set Luminance, Color to L + Synthetic L, Mono) to create a blend (also in mono). Then save this blend. This will be your new red color channel.
It should be stated that adding Ha to an RGB image doees not have an "exact" answer or "correct" method. You are combining narrow band with wide band data with very different signals and response curves, so any notion of exposure times or weightings goes out of the window. As a matter of fact, you can choose to use a very different approach to making you new red channel. The Layer module is perfect for this sort of thing due to its different filter types and compositing methods ("Layer Modes"). You could create a HDR composite with the "Min Distance to 1/2 Unity" filter, or use the "Lighten", "Add" or "Screen" Layer Modes. You may wish to chain different operations.

It goes without saying that when you have your new red channel, you don't want to use that as a basis for a synthetic luminance dataset. If you want to use a synthetic luminance frame,
Now use the Compose module again, set Luminance, Color to L, RGB, and load your full-color dataset as Luminance, Green and Blue, while loading your newly created red channel as Red.

You should now be ready to process the luminance of your full color stack as normal, while the Color module will bring in coloring that consists of R+Ha, G and B.

The other way is to process you color stack as normal and save it away.
Then to process your Ha stack as normal and overlay the two processed stacks in the Layer module using, for example, a Lighten blend mode.
The latter completely side-steps the method of the creation of a new red channel. E.g. you just process your RGB or LRGB as normal. Then process your Ha-only, save it, re-import it as red channel in the Compose module and turn off channel interpolation and set "Luminance, Color" to "RGB, RGB". This should yield a completely pure red (processed) image. Now open the Layer module and open the color image in the background. Set the Layer Mode to "Lighten", "Add", "Screen" or even "Color of Foreground". Try different Brightness Mask modes and Brightness Mask powers, try different filters and kernel radii to make the Ha "glow". Over-drive the effect with Blend Amount.

This is one of those answers that are a lot less straightforward, as there are so many ways to achieve different goals. That said, I've been thinking of adding dedicated functionality to make adding visual Ha easier...
Ivo Jager
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almcl
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Re: L ,Ha rgb

Post by almcl »

Brilliant!

Thank you so much, Ivo.

I'll have a go with both methods and see what can be made of my Synth L (from CLS filtered data) my RGB (non filtered data) and Ha stacks. Should keep me going for quite a while :thumbsup:
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Re: L ,Ha rgb

Post by lemmu »

Hello,
Seems there is so many questions about combining (mono in my case) LRGB+Ha over years and there is no single video tutorial explaining from the scratch. Could someone please make the proper Youtube tutorial? There are many users who would appretiate this. Anyone? Please...
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Re: L ,Ha rgb

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lemmu wrote: Sun Nov 08, 2020 5:43 pm Hello,
Seems there is so many questions about combining (mono in my case) LRGB+Ha over years and there is no single video tutorial explaining from the scratch. Could someone please make the proper Youtube tutorial? There are many users who would appretiate this. Anyone? Please...
Given there are so many different ways of doing it, with people having wholly different goals, a single video would simply not cover this complex subject adequately.

What exactly are you trying to achieve in your particular instance?
Ivo Jager
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lemmu
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Re: L ,Ha rgb

Post by lemmu »

HiIvo,
Well, the idea is incorporate the Ha to LRGB picture on M31.
I have calibrated 50 flats, 50 darks and dithered (yes, I started dither 3 pixels !) subs here stacked with DSS
https://www.dropbox.com/sh/713bgokf9fwl ... FH_oa?dl=0
integration time L 1.36 h, R 1.45 h. G 1, 51h, B 1,42 h. Ha 2.12 h. Shot over 2 nites,was some clouds occasionally. and full moon during Ha shooting.
If you can make from this decent result with log I would be very very happy and I won't need a video .
Please give a try.
P.S. The scope is 107 mm triplet APO and i haven't got the reducer yet.
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Re: L ,Ha rgb

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lemmu wrote: Tue Nov 10, 2020 7:58 pm Well, the idea is incorporate the Ha to LRGB picture on M31.
Can you kindly be a little more specific? Per my previous answers/questions, can you please tell us why you acquired the Ha and what the goal is?
For color accents? For detail? To add to the red channel?
Why did you acquire the amount that you did?
Ivo Jager
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lemmu
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Re: L ,Ha rgb

Post by lemmu »

Quick answer is for more detail. I have seen added Ha subs to M31 to enhance star forming regions in spiral arms. Those images are really stunning.
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