Tulip SH2-101

User images created with StarTools.
Mike in Rancho
Posts: 1160
Joined: Sun Jun 20, 2021 10:05 pm
Location: Alta Loma, CA

Re: Tulip SH2-101

Post by Mike in Rancho »

decay wrote: Sun Sep 03, 2023 3:20 pm
I'm sure, Mike is right in principle that mono does not take more time in general. But I too think here at our locations with such limited observation times OSC cams may be better suited. Sometimes it's impossible to get a second clear night for one object and with mono you would have to wait a whole year. Life's to short ;-)

Best regards, Dietmar.
Thanks for the vote of confidence! I think. :think:

First though, Freddy should be able to make great images with this new cam, much more efficient than DSLR especially if in any sort of LP, and the benefits of cooling and temperature matched darks.

Compared to mono, it'll be one of those "it depends" situations, of course. You have to be fully equipped with an EFW, controlled by NINA or in Freddy's case, APT could also do it I imagine. Using all pixels, you will have better efficiency and accuracy. There will be more files for pre-processing, but stacking will not involve debayering. Also everything can readily be properly stacked to a single reference. Very easy in WBPP. With DSS it could be more of a PITA to run each filter manually. Unsure about Siril, but on CN there was just a post where somebody did SHO files and they still had to be registered after the fact. Not optimal, per Ivo and the recommendations here.

But, if you know you can only capture for 2 hours, you would just set things up to take an hour of L and then 20m each of RGB. That's more than sufficient to grab some color and get a decent result, which should be better than 2 hours of OSC. And ST Compose makes it trivial to choose L, RGB if you don't think the RGB has sufficient SNR to use Synth L.

Or, if you don't know when the clouds will come in, you can just start looping shorter sequences of LRGB in the usual 3:1:1:1 ratio and again, you will be better off than the same capture in OSC. This seems especially the case in light pollution or short integration, where you aren't going to be able to pull off any special tricks like Bayer drizzle.

Of course without an EFW, say you are using a manual wheel, filter drawer, or threading a filter on, then yes mono acquisition can take a lot of time. This would be the case with a RASA.

Special objects like moving comets may also be better suited to OSC. I learned that the hard way with C/2022 E3 ZTF! :lol:
fmeireso
Posts: 375
Joined: Mon Sep 28, 2020 8:46 pm
Location: Belgium

Re: Tulip SH2-101

Post by fmeireso »

Mike in Rancho wrote: Sun Sep 03, 2023 6:59 pm

But, if you know you can only capture for 2 hours, you would just set things up to take an hour of L and then 20m each of RGB. That's more than sufficient to grab some color and get a decent result, which should be better than 2 hours of OSC. And ST Compose makes it trivial to choose L, RGB if you don't think the RGB has sufficient SNR to use Synth L.

Or, if you don't know when the clouds will come in, you can just start looping shorter sequences of LRGB in the usual 3:1:1:1 ratio and again, you will be better off than the same capture in OSC. This seems especially the case in light pollution or short integration, where you aren't going to be able to pull off any special tricks like Bayer drizzle.

Of course without an EFW, say you are using a manual wheel, filter drawer, or threading a filter on, then yes mono acquisition can take a lot of time. This would be the case with a RASA.

Special objects like moving comets may also be better suited to OSC. I learned that the hard way with C/2022 E3 ZTF! :lol:
Yeah, this pretty much sums it up. I am planning to use my astrocam color shots together with my mono Ha shots. And maybe i am not forced to use L,RGB but can use kind of synt L. This always never works with my DSLR color shot but it might work with the Touptek.

However, Todd Stephens on CN, informed me he had thesame idea since he has a mono modded Canon too, but he said that the images from his ZWO ASI 2600 are so good cause the camera is so much more sensitive he put that idea to bed, as he called it.

I just dunno...i will just have to find out..Hope it is clear tonight. The weather has become great but unfortunately heavily plagued with high clouds. forecast for tonight is somehow better..I just got to test...
Mike in Rancho
Posts: 1160
Joined: Sun Jun 20, 2021 10:05 pm
Location: Alta Loma, CA

Re: Tulip SH2-101

Post by Mike in Rancho »

fmeireso wrote: Mon Sep 04, 2023 7:22 am
Yeah, this pretty much sums it up. I am planning to use my astrocam color shots together with my mono Ha shots. And maybe i am not forced to use L,RGB but can use kind of synt L. This always never works with my DSLR color shot but it might work with the Touptek.

However, Todd Stephens on CN, informed me he had thesame idea since he has a mono modded Canon too, but he said that the images from his ZWO ASI 2600 are so good cause the camera is so much more sensitive he put that idea to bed, as he called it.

I just dunno...i will just have to find out..Hope it is clear tonight. The weather has become great but unfortunately heavily plagued with high clouds. forecast for tonight is somehow better..I just got to test...
Well I was talking about mono cam usage there. With OSC you are going to be using Synth L in ST, absent something unusual like HaRGB but I don't think that ever works out very well. Just my view of that sort of BB/NB combo. I like NB Accent so much better, and to boot it seems a more appropriate "documentary" way of mashing BB and NB together.

The pixels scales will no doubt be different, but you may be able to warp and scale one down to match the other, if using the mono DSLR for anything. PI should have that capability, though I am unsure if it can be tossed into WBPP all in one go, with one being OSC and the other (essentially) mono. Might have to stack the OSC first and then use that stack as a reference for the mono stack, say Ha, which you can then use in NB Accent.

Though that is probably correct that the astrocam QE will be so much better than the DSLR, that sticking with OSC would be the best result for broadband. Also I don't know if you mono Canon has hardcoded R and B scaling (would probably have to ask Mark Shelley), which would impair its usage for mono combinations.

Again, absent Ha for NB Accent, for which it might work out good enough.
decay
Posts: 456
Joined: Sat Apr 10, 2021 12:28 pm
Location: Germany, NRW

Re: Tulip SH2-101

Post by decay »

Mike in Rancho wrote: Sun Sep 03, 2023 6:59 pm Thanks for the vote of confidence! I think. :think:
It was meant that way, Mike :)
Mike in Rancho wrote: Sun Sep 03, 2023 6:59 pm Or, if you don't know when the clouds will come in, you can just start looping shorter sequences of LRGB in the usual 3:1:1:1 ratio and again, you will be better off than the same capture in OSC.
Yeah, that's probably the way to go. So the use of an EFW may be the key to mono for all of us blessed with unstable weather with lots of humidity of all kinds ;-)
decay
Posts: 456
Joined: Sat Apr 10, 2021 12:28 pm
Location: Germany, NRW

Re: Tulip SH2-101

Post by decay »

fmeireso wrote: Mon Sep 04, 2023 7:22 am Hope it is clear tonight. The weather has become great but unfortunately heavily plagued with high clouds. forecast for tonight is somehow better..I just got to test...
I was hoping for clear skies tonight too, Freddy. But now we have high clouds here too :( I might have a go tomorrow night ...
fmeireso
Posts: 375
Joined: Mon Sep 28, 2020 8:46 pm
Location: Belgium

Re: Tulip SH2-101

Post by fmeireso »

Finaly i could make a test. It looks good. Most of the things succeeded. But my object is still faint, aftr an integration time of about 2.5 hours. The elephant trunk. Maybe i should have choosen something different. Moon was still very disturbing.

But, well, it works....

Tonight another go. Then later on i think i will try to shoot some HA with the mono and combine...

ASTAP did a great job, blistering fast plate solving ...
Post Reply