Separate Wipes for RGB and NBAccent

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Stefan B
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Separate Wipes for RGB and NBAccent

Post by Stefan B »

After frequently using NBAccent I often encountered the problem that I'd like to apply a different Wipe to the NBAccent data than to the broadband RGB data. The broadband data suffers from more gradients/LP and would need a more aggressive Wipe compared to the NB data. Same for correlation filtering etc. But at the moment we are somewhat limited in that regard since you have to use the same Wipe parameters for both data sets.

The same probably applies to the luminance slot if you are using Ha or other NB data for luminance and broadband data for RGB. Maybe it would sometimes even be useful to separately wipe the RGB channels if you have a mono cam and recorded G during a different moon phase than B or you recorded both during the same night but your DSO has been in a different part of light dome for B than G.

Is there some way to implement something like channel specific Wipes for 1.9? Maybe a possibility to chain the channels during Wipe?

Regards
Stefan
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admin
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Re: Separate Wipes for RGB and NBAccent

Post by admin »

I hear you. I've thought about this a fair bit, but it's a tricky one to implement perfectly. For example, besides separate parameters, you'd probably want separate masks as well.

The best solution I have come up with so far, is;
  • Keep things as they currently are. E.g. running Wipe separately on datasets.
  • However with a new way of saving datasets that includes signal evolution data, so that importing previously wiped datasets still allows StarTools to track noise propagation optimally
This won't make things less cumbersome (e.g. separate Wipes are still needed), but should at least retain the benefits of signal evolution tracking.

:think:
Ivo Jager
StarTools creator and astronomy enthusiast
Mike in Rancho
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Re: Separate Wipes for RGB and NBAccent

Post by Mike in Rancho »

I would make use of that. :D

Though I can see how the complexities could be a bit grinding.

Perhaps a distinct Tracked Save button. Really just for the purpose of us Wiping and then recompositing all the bits. Of course, compositing all those tracked files back into some kind of merged tracking...perhaps difficult?

Would the saves be 32-bit, or is that not an issue? I''m not really sure at what point ST goes from 32 to 16 (if loaded as 32 of course) -- just at the final save, or Color?

I imagine though that, the crowd being what it is, the calls would be strong for that tracked and/or high bit save to be done at any location.

Unless this is only available for mono panels, again because of the intent to then composite.

:think:
Stefan B
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Re: Separate Wipes for RGB and NBAccent

Post by Stefan B »

Thanks for your reply, Ivo.
admin wrote: Thu Sep 08, 2022 1:40 am The best solution I have come up with so far, is;

Keep things as they currently are. E.g. running Wipe separately on datasets.
However with a new way of saving datasets that includes signal evolution data, so that importing previously wiped datasets still allows StarTools to track noise propagation optimally

This won't make things less cumbersome (e.g. separate Wipes are still needed), but should at least retain the benefits of signal evolution tracking.
Sounds reasonable. One of the things being difficult here is to make sure that the separate crops are done identical AND get rid of stacking artefacts from BOTH (or more data sets) while not knowing where they are for the second data set when cropping the first one. Any way to get around here!?

Regards
Stefan
dx_ron
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Re: Separate Wipes for RGB and NBAccent

Post by dx_ron »

Stefan B wrote: Thu Sep 08, 2022 6:24 am One of the things being difficult here is to make sure that the separate crops are done identical AND get rid of stacking artefacts from BOTH (or more data sets) while not knowing where they are for the second data set when cropping the first one. Any way to get around here!?

Regards
Stefan
I'd think you could just do preliminary autodev/crop on each separately and note the correct crop. Then go back and re-do them based on what you learned. Not that much work, and sometimes it's reasonable for us to do a bit of extra work instead of Ivo :lol:
Mike in Rancho
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Re: Separate Wipes for RGB and NBAccent

Post by Mike in Rancho »

Stefan B wrote: Thu Sep 08, 2022 6:24 am Sounds reasonable. One of the things being difficult here is to make sure that the separate crops are done identical AND get rid of stacking artefacts from BOTH (or more data sets) while not knowing where they are for the second data set when cropping the first one. Any way to get around here!?
Regards
Stefan
dx_ron wrote: Sat Oct 01, 2022 5:38 pm I'd think you could just do preliminary autodev/crop on each separately and note the correct crop. Then go back and re-do them based on what you learned. Not that much work, and sometimes it's reasonable for us to do a bit of extra work instead of Ivo :lol:
Actually, when the situation calls for this solution, I just pile everything together in compose for the "test" run-through. Otherwise it's hard to remember where each filter stack may offset all of the others. In crop, especially with that handy Color button ;), one should be able to see the missed overlaps. Add a little bit for stacking artifacts, which are hopefully small and just for dithering. But if you miss, a test Wipe should point them out and you could cancel and add more crop, adjusting your notes.

Then you could run through each one, with no need for a first AutoDev, cropping to spec, then bin if you want (or save that for the later final compose), an apply the appropriate wipe. Save. For each subsequent filter, as long as you haven't closed ST it will remember the crop sliders, making it all that easier.

When all your pre-wiped files are then composited, I think you still want to use Wipe (for tracking, color module...) but perhaps with all gradient stuff zeroed out.
Stefan B
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Re: Separate Wipes for RGB and NBAccent

Post by Stefan B »

Hi Mike,

yes, that's probably the way to go.

Regards
Stefan
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